Epilepsy seizures? Videos attached

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Beccab
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Nov 07, 2017 5:17 am

Epilepsy seizures? Videos attached

Post by Beccab » Tue Nov 07, 2017 8:56 am

Hi I'm looking for opinions from epilepsy dog owners. My vet wants to start my 1 yr old pug on phenobarbital but I'm just not convinced she has epilepsy. She will have these episodes around once a month or so where she becomes abnormally hyperactive running around like a maniac and when she stops, her head will be swaying back and forth and has loss of balance in her hind legs, also becomes more sleepy than usual. They can last anywhere from 10 mins but most are hours long. She is fully coherent and responsive when this happens. I'm just not seeing any other dog epilepsy seizure videos online that are similar to my pugs. Here is a link to a video, it's not the best example but take note when I try to make her stand up. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=mwiMubXoaOI

This is a link to the other pug owners videos that is having the same issues with her pug, this video gives a better idea of the head swaying back and forth and loss of balance.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=g77cE2muDvw

Gentle Jacob's mom
Posts: 927
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:52 am

Re: Epilepsy seizures? Videos attached

Post by Gentle Jacob's mom » Tue Nov 07, 2017 10:40 am

What a sweetheart. She's adorable.
I think if it were my dog, and if you can afford it, I would take her to a neurologist. It is possible that it could be some kind of seizure, but they would know a lot more because they deal with this every day.
I hope you find out what's going on.

Take Care,
Lynne

Beccab
Posts: 3
Joined: Tue Nov 07, 2017 5:17 am

Re: Epilepsy seizures? Videos attached

Post by Beccab » Tue Nov 07, 2017 1:07 pm

Unfortunately there aren't any neurologists on my side of the country. However the other pug owner has seen a neurologist already and is still undiagnosed.

Lovelight
Posts: 64
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2016 11:46 pm

Re: Epilepsy seizures? Videos attached

Post by Lovelight » Fri Nov 17, 2017 7:10 am

Hi, Light here,

Your pug is beautiful, what is her name?

I watched your video and I too am concerned as your are when I saw what you meant by her legs being weak. She does seem oriented but lack of interest in her toy...awww....., may I ask if this was after a recognized seizure or is the running around and leg weakness something that has just been happening without apparent seizure activity? How long has this been going on? You wrote once a month but for how many?

Grand mal seizures are easy to recognize because they are totally unconscious, fall to their side, and have shaking, labored breathing, foaming at mouth sometimes and are not responsive to your voice. In other words, you'd probably have no doubt if you see this. However, Petits, partial or focal seizures are a little harder to identify because they are conscious through it, respond to your voice and surroundings and it may not even look like anything is going on- you might see just part of their body acting weird shaking or repetitive movement, muscle contracting like they can't stretch it out if they wanted to, or like leg shakes on one side or end of the body or their hind legs (as examples), or you see their eye wander with the other focused, or see ear or eye twitches not moving by apparent choice ...things like that- those are all called partial, focal or petit seizures. Sometimes it doesn't even look like anything of seizures. I'm not sure whether yours had a focal or not at the time you took the video.

Leg weakness after seizures can be post seizure, but if it is persistent, it may be a neurological symptom that you should have addressed asap with a neurologist, not just a regular vet if possible. There are some behaviors that are typical, or usual, after seizures: frantic or excited pacing, excitement/panic, agitation, fear, disorientation, a little confusion, leg weakness, and these are just some common behaviors seen in dogs after seizures. It's whether or not these types of things remain long after the seizures have ended between episodes that requires neurological assessment. A regular vet can consult with a neurologist at a distance if there are none in your area, you may need to ask. Please do so if you can.

Another thing that can cause leg weakness: If the dog has had valium or is on other emergency medicine like clorazepate or rectal valium, or even prednisone (a steroid used to treat many different things), these all cause some leg weakness too - valium forms affects the legs and strength for a little while. However, if no drugs were given, any seizure effects should go away once your dog begins to normalize, which should begin to happen either within minutes, to a few hours, but it should never last longer than 24 hours. Anything longer than 24 hours, they consider persistent, which can mean neurological deficits are present and continual, which is usually indicative of something more than seizures is going on, which is why it needs assessment asap. However, leg weakness can be indicative of other ailments (ie spinal, joint or leg/hip injury) that need a different treatment and/or be anything but neurological.

Please don't wait to have her evaluated. While I don't wish to alarm you.... I'm just gently saying, your dog is a pug (she is wicked cute), and they can develop Pug Dog Encephalitis (PDE- which can present in different ways, especially if they have the slow-progressive rather than rapid-progressive), which is why I say DON'T wait to have her evaluated by a neurologist, even just to rule it out. PDE is really aggressive, even with the slow-progressive, and so it is best to rule that out as quickly as possible. It's a devastating disease and I DO speak from experience. I am NOT saying your dog has PDE nor am I even suggesting she does. It's just...I never thought my pug had PDE and I waited to see a neurologist....time spent without that consult was time wasted on less aggressive treatments. It's the ONLY thing I regret with my Buttercup because if we treated it more aggressively earlier, she may have lived longer. Butter endured the disease 18 months almost (2weeks shy) and when she died, she was just over 5 years old. Please don't make the same mistakes I did. It's better to know and rule out PDE, than to wait and waste precious time....said gently as I can from experience.

Butter's story from her beginning is here in the forum: under the Treatment and Maintenance Section, entitled "Newly Diagnosed 4 Year old Female Pug" (something of that nature). I put here story here to help others and her case was not like ANY pet here. You should read it just for information for you to compare; when my dog had her onset of seizures, it was intense from the beginning. She clustered her first time having seizures. Experienced status epilepticus seizures three weeks after onset, and one more time through her illness. Any time she had any seizures, it was almost always intense, and usually clustered from 2-14 seizures in say 12 hours having all types of seizures during ANY episode: focals, grands, focals that turned into grands... and that was despite emergency medicine and high doses of anticonvulsants. So her seizures were crazy from the start and mine had the mild form of PDE (slow-progressive). I pray your girl does not have what Butter did.

I do have some videos of my Buttercup and her leg weakness that I would like to share with you- just two, they are only a minute long each. Mine had PDE though, but leg weakness might look the same regardless of orientation (spinal, neurological, etc). I don't have them on youtube and have no idea how to upload it, but I can email them to you, so you can see and compare. If you wish to see her videos, just email me at l.santos811@gmail.com

I pray your beautiful pug gets better and that your questions are answered soon. Good luck with your girl, and let us know how she's doing.

Warmest regards,
Light

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