Diet change?

Questions about the influence of diet and metabolism on seizures.

Moderator: Box40Rin

Post Reply
Carolyn
Posts: 440
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2006 12:08 pm
Location: Long Island, NY

Diet change?

Post by Carolyn » Thu Feb 24, 2011 10:01 am

Hello everyone. My girl Kiya has been having more seizures lately. The latest one was this morning. I had her pb & kbr levels checked last week and they were within range. I asked the vet to increase pb to 60mg bid. I always said if she seemed to have more seizures I would look into changing her diet. Right now she's on Natural Balance original formula, which isn't a bad food, middle grade. I am so confused about home cooking with such a big dog, she's 112lbs. I am also in the middle of swiching to a new vet. We have an appointment with her saturday, but I think she may push Sience Diet which I feel is total crap. I know Kiya isn't as bad off as some other dogs and she's on a really low dose of meds.
Anyone here with a large breed dog on a home cooked diet?
Carolyn
Kiya 11yr Shiloh Shepherd
PB 60mg am 90mg pm, 1teas kbr 1200mg, turmeric paste
1000mg milkthistle bid
First seizure 11/27/05
Last seizure 5/21/15

Jim1155
Posts: 6
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 2010 6:47 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by Jim1155 » Thu Feb 24, 2011 6:52 pm

We used to home cook for our dog right after she started having seizures. She
is a springer spaniel, medium size. At that time we refused to believe that she was idiopathic. We removed everything from her environment that could possibly cause these seizures. NOTHING helped, not the home cooking either.
We took her to the vet and did a full ange of tests, scanned her brain, nothing out of the ordinary there.The only thing that has worked for her is Phenobarbital and lately the kbr. She has been on 120 mg a day. She has gone as long as 8 months without a seizure. We are now giving her 3.4 ml of potassium bromide, the liqiud version which she takes real well without any vomiting or nausea, and slowly decreasing her Pheno to help her liver. She is doing really well on both. We may not be able to totally get her off the pheno. We will be finding that out as time goes.
Jim

Apache
Posts: 256
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:50 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by Apache » Thu Feb 24, 2011 7:09 pm

Hi, Carolyn,

Presently, we have Apache on a home cooked diet. It wasn't by choice this time around, but we were eventually heading towards that road, anyway. He was half and half roughly a month ago. (Half kibble, half home cooked diet).

I am not certain that we're feeding Apache the right quantity at this present time, but he is doing well on it. He's 132 pounds,...and not overweight. I should point out, however, that right now, Apache is in the midst of a seizure-free run. In a week to 10 days from now, (which is when I'm expecting another round of seizures), I'll either have good news to report, or the same old. Granted, the reason we started this was to correct a bowel issue.

Essentially, we boil him batches of ground beef, batches of brown rice, and either Broccoli/Peas/Spinach. Instead of feeding him twice daily, we now feed him 4 times a day and obviously, in smaller increments. He also gets a multi-vitamin daily, plus some Vitamin C chewables. Taurine will be added shortly. (We've all had the flu here this past week, so I haven't picked it up yet).

His bowels are great, he hasn't gone into extreme high's and low's,...and knock on wood, I hope it does help with his seizures. But again, time will tell.

I'm still confused about the quantity to feed him. For now, though, he's doing very well on what we've been giving him. If I learn anymore about 'quantities', I'll let you know. Please do the same. It is all very confusing. Check YouTube,....and you'll know what I mean.

Brian

Carolyn
Posts: 440
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2006 12:08 pm
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Diet change?

Post by Carolyn » Fri Feb 25, 2011 11:53 am

Hello, sorry the homecooking didn't work for your dog Jim. I want to think maybe because at that time he wasn't on meds. Kiya's been on pb & kbr since November of 2005, my hopes for her getting off them have been flushed down the bowl. I was able to lower the pb from the original 97mg bid to 30mg bid now where back up to 60mg bid. Anyway if your dog isn't on milk thistle you should look into it. My vet said it must be what is keeping her liver values down.
Brian I decided I am going to follow the recipe on the guardian angels website to start. They even make the suppliement issue sound easy enough. It's nice to know Apache is big so we can kind of compare notes till we get the hang of it. My dog trainer has been feeding homecooked for years, I am going to pick her brain.
I would be thrilled if Kiya can make another 253 day run.
Carolyn
Kiya 11yr Shiloh Shepherd
PB 60mg am 90mg pm, 1teas kbr 1200mg, turmeric paste
1000mg milkthistle bid
First seizure 11/27/05
Last seizure 5/21/15

Apache
Posts: 256
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:50 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by Apache » Wed Mar 02, 2011 5:39 pm

Hi, Carolyn,

I tried the Guardian Angels recipe. Unfortunately, Apache didn't do too well on it. I believe he's either sensitive to the regular potatoes and/or carrots. And, you're right, their listing of supplements sure sounds easy enough to follow.

I wish you luck with the GA recipe. I sure hope Kiya does well on it!

Brian

Jazille
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:30 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by Jazille » Sun Mar 06, 2011 3:47 pm

I switched to home cooked for Katan just before Christmas. Katan was 120 lbs of Tibetan Mastiff and now is 115 lbs of Tibetan Mastiff. I cook chicken breast or ground turkey, ground meat at least 80/20 pouring off the extra fat in meat loaf tins. Meanwhile I steam Kale and boil sweet potatoes then mix everything together and feed with white potatoes as the carb. I was feeding too much meat mixture to carb according to the vet as the meat mixture has more calories than the potatoes. I also give RX Essential Minerals and Vitamins, Taurine and Milk Thistle, Dasuquin and fish oil capsules.

Jazille
Jazille
Katan epi Tibetan Mastiff
Kbr, Pheno - emergency Keppra

Apache
Posts: 256
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:50 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by Apache » Sun Mar 06, 2011 4:23 pm

Hi, Jazille,

May I ask how much you're feeding Katan per meal? And, how often you feed him?

Thanks,

Brian

Jazille
Posts: 3
Joined: Sun Mar 06, 2011 1:30 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by Jazille » Mon Mar 07, 2011 7:43 am

Hello Brian

I feed Katan twice a day. Half a cup of the protein mix in the am with a cup of potatoes - I add the dasuquin and fish oil capsules in the am feed. A cup of the protein with 1.5 cups of potatoes in the pm plus vitamins and taurine in this feed. I also add at least 1 cup of the frozen green beans in the evening. His coat has become very luxuriant but I can't see any difference in the seizing pattern - unfortunately.

The Kbr became more potent due to the low sodium versus commercial diet causing increased ataxia and sedation. We had a 5 week break from seizing. I dropped the Kbr dose and 11 days later Katan seized again and then 10 days later (yesterday) another. It appears more and more as if I can have a zombie without seizes or Katan with seizures.

Jaz
Jazille
Katan epi Tibetan Mastiff
Kbr, Pheno - emergency Keppra

radagasts_momma
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 10:01 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by radagasts_momma » Wed Mar 16, 2011 4:21 pm

I do a mix of home cooked, raw, and kibble for Radagast.

Dogs actually do ok on raw, they just need some probiotics until they get used to it. Radagast's regular kibble, Wellness Ocean Formula, contains probiotics. I do 1/2 recommended daily dose of his kibble and 1/2 recommended daily dose of the raw diet. I supplement throughout the day with carrots, green beans, celery, apple, banana, sweet potato, etc to address the hunger issue and keep something in his tummy to avoid reflux. I also give him raw bones with some raw meat on them that I get from the butcher. Marrow bones are great because I can give them to him in his crate unsupervised and not worry if he's going to have a seizure and get it lodged in his throat.

Dog's stomaches are more acidic than ours so the risk of bacterial issues from raw meat is not the same as it is for us. When feeding veggies I will typically steam them or grate them because it's harder for dogs to digest plant fibers (their ancestors ate the partially digested stomach contents of their prey).

Carolyn
Posts: 440
Joined: Thu Feb 16, 2006 12:08 pm
Location: Long Island, NY

Re: Diet change?

Post by Carolyn » Thu Mar 17, 2011 2:28 pm

Hi everyone. I brought Kiya to our new vet. I like her, she did not try to push anything on us and has no problem writing prescriptions for us. I gave her Kiya's history and she wants me to wait until we do blood work in April before I change her diet. Call me chicken, but I'll do as she advises right now. It seems that most haven't noticed a change in seizure frequency anyway. Maybe I'm drawing at staws again.
Carolyn
Kiya 11yr Shiloh Shepherd
PB 60mg am 90mg pm, 1teas kbr 1200mg, turmeric paste
1000mg milkthistle bid
First seizure 11/27/05
Last seizure 5/21/15

Apache
Posts: 256
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:50 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by Apache » Sun Mar 20, 2011 7:57 pm

I for one, haven't seen a change in Apache's seizure activity since changing his diet, unfortunately. It wasn't the reason for changing his diet, but I held out hope that perhaps it would help with his seizures at the same time.

Good luck with Kiya, and I'm glad you like the new vet.

Brian

Apache
Posts: 256
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 7:50 pm

Re: Diet change?

Post by Apache » Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:03 pm

radagasts_momma wrote:I do a mix of home cooked, raw, and kibble for Radagast.

Dogs actually do ok on raw, they just need some probiotics until they get used to it. Radagast's regular kibble, Wellness Ocean Formula, contains probiotics. I do 1/2 recommended daily dose of his kibble and 1/2 recommended daily dose of the raw diet. I supplement throughout the day with carrots, green beans, celery, apple, banana, sweet potato, etc to address the hunger issue and keep something in his tummy to avoid reflux. I also give him raw bones with some raw meat on them that I get from the butcher. Marrow bones are great because I can give them to him in his crate unsupervised and not worry if he's going to have a seizure and get it lodged in his throat.

Dog's stomaches are more acidic than ours so the risk of bacterial issues from raw meat is not the same as it is for us. When feeding veggies I will typically steam them or grate them because it's harder for dogs to digest plant fibers (their ancestors ate the partially digested stomach contents of their prey).
Wow! Can I come over to your place for supper sometime?

Seriously, though,...that's quite the menu. I should try our guy on some banana. He's okay with apples, but if we give him a little too much, we're in trouble the next day.

Marrow bones I thought were fine for Apache. That is, until he grew up and started breaking them. No joke, he can snap those thick bones. Now, when we do give him one,...rarely as it is,...we make sure to keep him close by to us.

Brian

Post Reply