checking?

Would you like to see your club more involved in making members aware of epilepsy in your breed? Has your club done a good job on a health survey, or awareness campaign? Any novel fundraisers or other activities by your club? Please share what you would like to see your clubs do, and the things that clubs are already doing that have worked.

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way
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2002 12:01 am
Location: fenton,mo usa

checking?

Post by way » Mon Jun 17, 2002 3:46 pm

Is there anyway of checking on backgrounds on dog breeder that have alot of epilepsy in background?

Melissa and Raven
Posts: 68
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:10 pm
Location: Barrie Ontario
Contact:

Post by Melissa and Raven » Thu Nov 01, 2007 3:58 pm

Depending on Breed yes. I see you have a Brittany...I'm not sure if they have a health registery for Brittany's...but for those of you with Standard Poodles with Epilepsy, Allergies or anything else...I encourage you to register your dogs health on The Poodle Health Registery website.

http://www.poodlehealthregistry.org/


I'm sure most of you knew about that already...but just in case....

High_Voltage_Head
Posts: 193
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 10:00 pm
Location: Minnesota

Post by High_Voltage_Head » Thu Nov 01, 2007 7:02 pm

Oh thanks Melissa, i've never seen that before. I'd be happy to put Jackson in their database but the forms are a bit confusing....i'll try emailing the person in charge. Maybe they only want registered dogs, and i don't think i ever registered (AKC?) Jackson. Plus, he only has one name and everyone else there has about five, so they might make fun of him. I do have his pedigree though, and i'm sure his relatives will be thrilled to have him drag their names through the mud. Too bad for them!

Hey, i looked at your website on dogster. Looks like you're running a poodle ranch. Rancho Del Poodles. Fun!
Me: Kurt
Dog: Jackson the 6 y.o. Standard Poodle 55lbs
died March '08

Dylans Dad
Posts: 490
Joined: Sun Oct 08, 2006 5:12 am
Location: SE Iowa
Contact:

Post by Dylans Dad » Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:11 am

you are dogsterers? me too
Wags & Slurps
Debby & Dylan
6 yr old Border collie
1st aug 7 2006
last 7-18-08
375 MG kbr twice a day
1 47.5 pb twice a day

MK's mom
Posts: 1708
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:48 am
Location: Michigan

Post by MK's mom » Fri Nov 02, 2007 7:30 am

Way,

If a person registers their dog on databases, that is one way to research lines, but in many cases (especially when show dogs are involved) folks are reluctant to make anything public because of the backlash it can cause for the breeder and their lines.

If you know show people who own your breed, you can quietly ask around, but again some people are so closed mouth about epilepsy and other maladies. It's very hard to get people to talk about such things. If a breeder has petted out any of their dogs it's doubly hard to find out if any of those pups are epis. My breeder is will known in her breed and didn't know of the epilepsy that ran in the sire's line until MK started seizing. She asked all the right questions, but folks weren't honest until their reputations were nearly ruined because of it. Epilepsy is made far worse because of the dishonest show people, that I can attest to.

Vivian
Nathan
3.5 yo Irish Setter boy
First seizure 7/26/2013
Last seizure 3/24/2014
__________________________________
MK
5 yo Irish Setter boy
First seizure 1/25/06
Last seizure 9/4/2009

Aug 17, 2004- Sept. 22, 2009
May the shamrocks fall softly sweetpea

MK's mom
Posts: 1708
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:48 am
Location: Michigan

Post by MK's mom » Fri Nov 02, 2007 7:40 am

Kurt,

If your breeders haven't been outted yet, I think it's about time! Unless of course they're not using the suspected epi carriers anymore, then Jackson's epilepsy can be forgiven. It's the breeders that keep using the same carriers over and over and spreading this hell, they're the ones that need to be outted and then some. I'm currently on a mission to bring down some fresh hell on someone myself. :D

V
Nathan
3.5 yo Irish Setter boy
First seizure 7/26/2013
Last seizure 3/24/2014
__________________________________
MK
5 yo Irish Setter boy
First seizure 1/25/06
Last seizure 9/4/2009

Aug 17, 2004- Sept. 22, 2009
May the shamrocks fall softly sweetpea

High_Voltage_Head
Posts: 193
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 10:00 pm
Location: Minnesota

Post by High_Voltage_Head » Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:10 pm

Vivian, I did talk to the breeder when Jackson was first diagnosed. She's a vet and was very sorry and tried to be helpful but she lives in a different state and, you know, i wasn't about to give him back to her. She had already stopped breeding his parents because, in her words, "the sire is quite elderly and the dam is of retirement age as well." I had to laugh because i'd never heard anyone talk about dogs like that. As far as what the breeder did with the information, i have no idea.

I have given his pedigree info for use in a study at Florida State, but really, i've never done any kind of "outing". I can only imagine how many siblings he has, and how many children his siblings have had. They're like rabbits! I don't know what to do except enter his info into this database that Melissa mentioned. I'm not even sure what the genetics of it imply about his siblings or half-siblings and their offspring.
Me: Kurt
Dog: Jackson the 6 y.o. Standard Poodle 55lbs
died March '08

High_Voltage_Head
Posts: 193
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 10:00 pm
Location: Minnesota

Post by High_Voltage_Head » Fri Nov 02, 2007 10:16 pm

Debby, i'm not a dogsterer, i just followed Melissa's link over there and wasn't sure what dogster is....i saw lotsa poodle pics though.
Me: Kurt
Dog: Jackson the 6 y.o. Standard Poodle 55lbs
died March '08

Melissa and Raven
Posts: 68
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:10 pm
Location: Barrie Ontario
Contact:

Post by Melissa and Raven » Sat Nov 03, 2007 6:31 am

Hey guys!
Dogster and Caster is kind of like "facebook" for dogs and cats. Just fun. I nice easy way to brag about your furkids by sending 1 simple link to friends and family that has their history, bio and pictures.
Yes...seems once you resgister, that other people who have the same breed can search "Poodle" "Ontario" and send friend requests so it does look like I have a poodle Ranch. LOL! But only Raven and George are mine.

I'm not sure the Poodle Health Registery isn't for bashing breeders though. It's more helpful than hurtful I find. For instance, Raven hasn't been diagnosed as "Epilepsy" so I can put her info on there but under "Seizures" not "Eplilepsy" I don't see any other of her breeders dogs on there for Epilepsy, I do for hip problems, but not Raven's line. I do see one of George's though. His father (Sire)was a carrier of Addison's disease so they immidately stopped breeding him. Fortunately, George's mom (dam) is clear, so my George-a-licious is still healthy as a horse. I wouldn't feel shameful or revengeful for posting your dog there. It's a helful site for people like you and me. If something happens to our Poodles, we can look there for other lines related...if it seems to be running in those lines I can assure you most breeders will stop breeding those lines (good breeders) and those that don't - get exposed to Poodle Clubs like PCC and PCA.

"It's a good thing"

M.

MK's mom
Posts: 1708
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:48 am
Location: Michigan

Post by MK's mom » Sat Nov 03, 2007 6:44 am

Just so no one understands where I'm coming from, I don't want to bash anyone that doesn't deserve it. Epilepsy and other bad things happen to the most conscientious breeders. The ones I have issues with are the ones who KNOWINGLY continue using carriers of anything. The man who co-owns my boy's sire knows the sire and his littermate have each thrown epileptic puppies and he refuses to see that it's in that line, so he keeps breeding the stud. This man is very prominent in the Irish community and is an AKC judge!!!!! He's been around a long time and should know better.

As for your vet breeder Kurt, it's scary to think how many other puppies her stuff has produced and she didnt' stop using them until they were too old? Hopefully Jackson was the one and only pup to be born with the epilepsy and that no others aren't afflicted with it. I would hold that breeder vet to a much higher accountability than I would a regular breeder.

If there was a registry for Irish I would have my boy's name and pedigree up there in a flash, but unfortunately I don't know of a registry for my breed. How does one start a registry, does anyone know?

Vivian
Nathan
3.5 yo Irish Setter boy
First seizure 7/26/2013
Last seizure 3/24/2014
__________________________________
MK
5 yo Irish Setter boy
First seizure 1/25/06
Last seizure 9/4/2009

Aug 17, 2004- Sept. 22, 2009
May the shamrocks fall softly sweetpea

skrpio
Posts: 1143
Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 5:34 pm
Location: Auckland , New Zealand

Post by skrpio » Sat Nov 03, 2007 2:51 pm

Vivian - I understand completely where you are coming from and until the unethical breeders are outed nothing is going to stop them from continuing this practice. You can see by the increasing numbers of epi dogs that the problem is escalating.
The thing with genetic epliepsy is that even though the littermates of affected dogs do not have seizures, they could still be carrying the gene and it will come out in the next or several generations later. By this time how many other pups are affected?
I did not know how much of a problem this was as I had never heard of an epileptic dog until KiKi began, but when I went to the Jean Dodds lecture I was amazed at the number of epi dog owners there and nearly all of them were breeders. New Zealand (pop 4 Million) is only a small place and this was one meeting out of four and not even in a large city. God knows how many epi dogs are in this country.

Can you contact the poodle registry and find out how to go about setting up a register. Consdiering how many Irish Setters are affected it might make interesting reading. Finn could go on too. Contact Ron and ask him - he might know.
Jane
In loving memory of my special KiKi Bean
Seizure free forever now
Nov 25th 2002 - Nov 1st 2006
Dogue De Bordeaux

Melissa and Raven
Posts: 68
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:10 pm
Location: Barrie Ontario
Contact:

Post by Melissa and Raven » Thu Nov 22, 2007 9:12 am

Vivian and Jane,
Have you ladies had any luck yet?

MK's mom
Posts: 1708
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2006 9:48 am
Location: Michigan

Post by MK's mom » Thu Nov 22, 2007 11:12 am

Melissa,

I haven't had any luck that I know of. I'm on a mission to destroy the reputation of the man who owns MK's father and will continue breeding him although he has thrown more than one epi puppy. funny thing is, when I tell people about him and his recklessness they're already aware of it!! Most folks are disgusted with it, but there are some that will still breed to the sire because he was a top winning Irish a few years ago.

I can only speculate why they're not concerned. I guess they either don't care if a puppy gets epilepsy or they don't think it will happen to them. Some of those people might believe that an epileptic dog only seizes a couple of times a year and can go without medication, maybe they've never had to deal with the bad cases like we have on this forum. or, maybe they're just a$$%^&*s.

Vivian
Nathan
3.5 yo Irish Setter boy
First seizure 7/26/2013
Last seizure 3/24/2014
__________________________________
MK
5 yo Irish Setter boy
First seizure 1/25/06
Last seizure 9/4/2009

Aug 17, 2004- Sept. 22, 2009
May the shamrocks fall softly sweetpea

skrpio
Posts: 1143
Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2005 5:34 pm
Location: Auckland , New Zealand

Post by skrpio » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:40 pm

I have had no luck but KiKi's breeder did a lot to try and track down where it came from as no other dogs in either of the lines have had seizures ( that we are aware of)
I do not think KiKi's seizures were idiopathic. I think they were caused by annual vaccinations and the fact she had a very low thyroid level. She began seizing 14 days after her vaccs and when I told the vet the following year she was not going to have them again he made no objections. They know that vaccs affect some dogs but this in turn also affects their income if all vaccs were stopped after the initial puppy ones.
Jane
In loving memory of my special KiKi Bean
Seizure free forever now
Nov 25th 2002 - Nov 1st 2006
Dogue De Bordeaux

Melissa and Raven
Posts: 68
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2007 8:10 pm
Location: Barrie Ontario
Contact:

Post by Melissa and Raven » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:44 pm

Vivian,

I remember that mission. I've had several like that. With little success. I hope with everything in me you have better luck than I did.
Sometimes I think people think Epilepsy is a fluke, a birth defect, like it doesn't pass down through genetics. When I start saying that it IS genetic and that they SHOULDN'T be bred, they ask "Are you saying that PEOPLE with Epilepsy or Diabetes shouldn't have kids?" That question always makes me a moving target.
Some people just don't get it. Some people just don't care. I'm not sure which is more dangerous.

Best of luck.

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